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Brakes
NB: Originally posted elsewhere on the Global Riders Network and appears via syndication.
I'm thinking of changing my brakes on my rockhopper to something better then my Tektro Auriga Comp's. I find they don't have much power, and feel. Anyone have any suggestions? And am i limited to my rotor size by my bike or can i go bigger.
Thanks once again
Jono
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http://cgi.ebay.com.au/NEW-Hygia-USAGI-hydraulic...
I have just bought these but not ridden them yet, A friend of mine also bought a pair (in black) and says their not bad, they are magura lever copies and Shimano caliper copies. They use XT or XTR pads. come fully assembled and bled.
I payed GBP 83.00 Approximately AU $149.03 for the F & R includes rotors, adapter, brackets and screws. Nice and lite too!
worth a thought!
Pikey
I don't think you really need to go bigger with the rotors for an XC hardtail. I put 180mm front / 160mm rear with Hayes Nines on my first hardtail and it was too much. Hayes are a bit sudden anyway, but every time I went on the dirt I was nervous. Part of that was no doubt the ordinary WTB Veliciraptors I had on at the time, but with good brakes like the Shimanos I have, I find 160mm is fine for the riding I do.
Maybe stick to known brands like Shimano and Avid if you don't want to take a risk with unkown brands. Second hand can be good value for money if you buy carefully - look carefully at the pix.
id go for go for shimano deore, there cheap and they work, or if you want lighter ones buy xt. ive always used shimano but have avids now and dont really like them.
you can probably go bigger by getting a different caliper mount.
has anyone had any experience with the juicys (3,5,7 whatever). How much can you pick the deores up for, and witch avids are you using at the moment ray?
I have juicys 7 and they work good although I haven't tried anything in the same category before. Prior to that I have only had mechanical and entry level hydraulics before. I think the only difference between the 5 and 7 is the 7's have adjuster knobs where you need to use tools to do the same thing on the 5's.
I saw the 5's on ebay for $300.00 but ive heard alot of different things about them, some say there terrible, some say there great. So im just not sure what to believe, i guess the only way to no is to try them out :S And they are a bit steep in price too, I did see the shimano deore m525's for $176.00 all up posted witch is preitty good and they dont sound too bad.
Thanks
Jono
What about the avid codes and elixir's? Im looking for some good vaule for money. stopping power + modulation + feel!
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Avid-Elixir-5-Hydraulic-D...
?
have avid elixir cr's on special at the moment for $320 & thats for both ends.I use these brakes & they are awesome, stopping power & modulation.
There just as little expensive. http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Shimano-XT-Dual-Control-H...
These seem good, but would the shifter work with my current drive-train ( deore everything ), would i notice an improvement over my deore shifter
Thanks
... definitely work OK with your Deore RD - they're compatible - but to get the best out of them you'd be better off eventually swapping the RD to "Rapid Rise". But you wouldn't need to do so straight away.
What I particularly like about Dual Control using Rapid Rise is that it means that you can downshift on the rear simultaneously while on the brakes without sending yourself over the bars - it makes setting yourself up for changes in the trail a lot easier. But Rapid Rise isn't essential - you can still use a regular High Normal RD with them.
If you want to try them out you're more than welcome to drop by my place and take my bike for a spin 'round the neighbourhood - as you know I'm unable to ride for a few more weeks while the hand heals. We have them on all our bikes.
Would i notice an improvement in the shifters with my derailer and does anyone no if the actuall brakes are good ( do they provide what ik looking for
) Oh and because they dont come with rotors could i use my current ones?
Thanks
Yes to all your questions: very noticeable improvement - one finger braking.
Shifting will be less tiring on your fingers. Yes, you should be able to use your current discs. Regarding the other proposition I've put to you, if they don't fit the discs as you need, I'll gladly accept them back and refund you - no risk.
How do i no if my brakes need a bleed? Im thinking they might because theres a bit of slack between the lever and the caliper engaging. And does anyone no if my brakes are supposed to be good? Maybe they are and im just thinking there bad because theres air in the lines?!?!
Thanks
jono
on my bike, it's a tiny tiny screw on the fulcrum / pivot of the brake lever / handle ...
the trick is not to let it get to be too big.
The gap stops your pads from rubbing on the discs. If you have air in the lines the brake lever will just go straight to the bar - and you'll go straight ahead.
As byron has said, there's an adjustment grubscrew that allows you to adjust how far out the lever goes ("reach") but that does not adjust the gap. High end Avids have a gap adjustment that's separate from reach, but I haven't really ever needed it.
If you come by on teh weekend I can show you what's what.
I should be picking my brakes up soon and was wondering about pads and fluid; I plan on changing pads and bleeding the brakes. Must i go sintered or resin, is there more stopping power from the sintered and modulation or what :S And where must i buy the stuff, crc? or will i get ripped off retail.
Thank you
Jono
place is flea bay if you know how much they are in the shop try to get them on flea bay you can save a few dollars or put a big order in for CRC i'm sure there will be some keen buyers on here
Picked them up today and cant wait to give them a go. My mind is still boggling how im going to shift and brake at the same time, i guess theres gonna be a lot of getting used to! And by the way can i use my existing shifter cables instead of re-routing and reinstalling the ones on the brakes, i dont want to start stuffing around with my rear derailer if i dont have to.
Thanks for evreryones help and suggestions
jono
Nobmobber Andy Bloot recommended Fibtrax sintered disc pads to me awhile back and I've been very happy with them.
Resin ones wear rapidly in the wet or damp as I mentioned previously.
The sintered metallic are prone to being a little noisy from time to time, usually when wet or dusty, but I'll put up with that if it means they're still there at the end of the ride if the weather turns. Braking power is pretty good. I got mine from CRC on a group buy that Andy organised.
Another place to look is Discobrakes. They do some good product at the right price as well. LBS prices for OEM pads stink.
You may not need to bleed the brakes - it's simple one you know how, but there is some kit you need to buy to do it properly. See if you can get by without.
Ive installed the dual control levers and connected up the brakes. The brakes are working but not how i would like them to. There is NO POWER! I don't think they need to be bled maybe a top up or something because the calipers do move when i pull in the lever. Oh and theres also a lot of noise from the pads maybe thats just a clean.
Now for a different matter with the shifters. Can i unscrew the shifter cables from the dual control pods and do a strait swap over between the pods, in doing so not having to take the cable out of the sleeve and disconnect the cable from the rear derailer
Thanks
Jono
You definitely need to make sure there is no air. Do the levers come very close to the grips when sqeezed because if so there is air in them. Also, did you replace the calipers as well?
Not at all, the brakes fully take at half way witch is aprox 3cm from the grips and when there fully open there about 6cm from the grips so halfway.
Im guessing maybe theres some brake fluid on the pads or something, just something making them slip and causing them to squeek.
Thanks
Ha! Knew you wouldn't be able to resist!
Brake pads take time to bed in. You need to give them a good couple of hard stops from speed before you start to get anywhere close tp full power. But with an unkown brake set I'd be testing on a very quiet road that gives you an uphill escape route, and gradually build up the speed. That said, you are possibly right that the pads have been contaminated. Testing will tell.
If you don't mind I'd like to give your install the once-over on the weekend. A second set of eyes is useful.
A colleague tried pretty hard to kill himself on the ride to work Monday morning when the front brakes separated themselves from the fork. He'd disregarded some pretty obvious warning signs that all was not right, but a once-over by someone else with some tools and some loctite would have saved him from getting into the situation in the first place.
Fortunately he wasn't on a busy road at the time or it would have ended differently!
As I mentioned to you, the rear pads should probably be replaced however the front should be fine from memory.
It was only like a 10min job I'm defiantly replacing the rears matt and thanks again
And hawkeye with pleasure u can have a once over, brakes arent something u stuff around with. I will try give a good few firm stops on an empty road going to go do it now so will let you no the results.
Thanks
theres just no power! under half of what my tektro's had there must be something wrong maybe my setup? Could they need a top up? Just out of ideas.
XT's are right up there for power.
How hard are you braking? I'm talking from 40-50km/hr on a downhill, one finger on the end of the lever and hard as you can without getting the rear in the air. Repeat at least 3 times, more is better. Pads and disc need to wear in to each other.
You should notice an improvement after 3 bedding-in runs, and more over the next hour or so of riding so that by the end of the first ride you are appropriately impressed.
Oh far out i havent done that yet. And its a little hard getting that fast due to me having a ss bike at the moment ( my connected shifters are in the bottle holder out of reach
)
Ok ok later tonight ill do that i dont want to cross the road right now there some magpies there giving me the eye, they look like there up 2 no good
Let you no how it goes,
Jono
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/4-PAIRS-SHIMANO-DEORE-LX-B... Worth a thought
not cheap in the uk unless you go thru chain reaction
$35.00 Too my door for 4 pairs (8 pads) opposed to $35.00 for one pair at st ives??? Sounds pretty cheap to me.
So you haven't bedded them in yet? Ma-aate!
For replacement pads, go the Fibrax sintered metallic - unless someone can suggest something better?
looks like you will keep that bike for a fair while Jonathan or you are going to ride at Terrey hills in the rain a lot ?
The pads i found for sale are fibrax semi metallic for $35 to my door (4 pair's) But my logic for this is that for $35 i can have 4 pairs from the uk or 1 pair from Sydney, i do plan on replacing the pads in the both calipers just for piece of mind (at least the front ones) And its always good to have a spare set or two. Why pay $35 every time i change pads when i can do it for zero?
And hawkeye i tried breaking pretty dam hard at speed not 40- 50 km h but prob's around 25 km h (just for testing purposes) and i realized that the lever comes pretty much up too the grip with a fair bit of resistance and at that point my back wheel was hardly lifting and i was giving it the berries.
Im thinking the brakes are used surely they would be bedded in?
Could the fluid just need a top up?
Jono
If the levers are going to the bar you probably do need a fluid top-up.
Each time you change pads or swap a wheelset the pads need to be bedded in again. It is the pads and discs bedding in together.
Go the UK for purchasing the pads. LBS prices for pads here are stupid.
holding the brakes on for too long try giving them pulses when you are trying to bed them, no t to just rip them on hard you might do more damage to your rotors too . Try a couple of little squezzes then pull them on too a stop
Too be honest theres just so little power if i were to pulse i don't thing anything would happen, grabbing a serious handful going downhill im only just able to get the back in the air and i have to put all my weight over the front to do that.
Im not sure if bedding is the problem. Does bedding in really make that much difference in power becasue i really think they need a top up or something. The brakes should be fully taking at about half way witch they aren't
Could it be that my pads or rotors are glazed over? And under really hard braking in the front im also hearing lots of noise. Witch could mean that the pads need a clean i guess
Thanks, jono
... and we'll take a look at it.
At least then we can determine whether it's the pads or your fingers that need work
. You'll also be able to ride my bike and get a feel for what brakes should feel like.
I have brake cleaner and emery paper in abundance so we can at least dress the pads and get you a bit better braking until the replacements arrive.
Could you please visit a LBS and get a Shimano brake fluid kit. Try BA or Belrose cycles. It's not cheap but worth having. I have the rest of the stuff needed to do a flush and bleed, including workstand.
Thanks a million! when u say the bleeding kit isint cheap how much is it
What time should i bring 'er round?
Thanks again
Jono
it was something stupid like $20-30 for a little bottle of mineral oil, plastic bag and tube, compared to $6 for a bottle of DOT brake fluid. Unfortunately DOT brake fluid isn't compatible with Shimano or Tektro systems.
So anyway i bought the bleed kit for about $30.00 and i ended up walking out the shop with a new front tire i bought? Maxxis larsen tt 2.35, so i went wider as well ( from a 2.0). Found the bike very slippery and washy at the front so this should solve it.
Jono
Huge thanks to hawkeye! helped me fit my brakes shifters and tire today, really appreciate it. Thanks for all your time and specialist expertise.
Jono
So do the brakes now have stopping power?
There's an issue with with either the pads being contaminated or the disc rotors' brake tracks being worn funny.
The OEM Tektro disc rotors are, shall we say, an interesting shape:
The forks shudder back and forth under brakes in time with the wide parts of the brake track.
There were some odd wear patterns on the rotors. I don't think the faces are fully flat, they're perhaps not getting full contact with the brake pads. 
Jono's going to get himself some XT brake rotors and probably some fibrax pads. I gave him a quick ride on my bike which has the same brakeset so that he knows what to expect when his settle in.
And what a set of brakes they are! Hopefully ill buy them tonight.
Jono
So far ive bought the rotors xt 160mm $56.00 All up. Waiting to find out how much postage is on the pads.
Bought the pads $49.00 to my door 10 pads.
So is everything all working now?
Yup, update please.
Need the parts to arrive first then ill let you no
Its been about 8days now since i ordered the stuff. The pads are coming from the uk and rotors from israel so it shouldn't be much longer to wait. It was all posted standard post but more importantly its getting difficult to wait now unless i want to go for a ride and not come back
When the stuff arrives im more then certainly posting a ride that weekend maybe something easy, perimeter and long just so i can scrub my pads and rotors in properly and not run into problems. By the way what can i join to make perimeter and long a bit more of a ride. I was thinking of maybe even trying turramurra?
Thanks...Jono