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Tyres - For Wet/Muddy Conditions.
Hi Everyone!
I fairly new to Mountain Biking and this is my first post here on these forums!
Apologies if i have missed a post on this topic, i had a look around, and some helpful topics but nothing regarding wet/muddy coniditions and tyres
I've been riding since about September last year, I am currently using a CrossMark 2.1 on the Rear, and a Rendez 2.1 on the Front. These have done very well over the last month or so since i put them on the bike. The set that is sitting ont he sidelines now are Specialized - The Captains 2.0/2.2 which came with my bike.
I am not 100% confident that my Tyre's will perform that well in muddier/wet conditions, i have ridden in moderately wet conditions on loose dirt/grassy track up in the near the watigans on a friends property and they seemed to hold up ok, the front sometimes took awhile to bite on corners and has left me thinking I might need something for harsher conditions.
I was after some opinions as to other tyres for these conditions. I have heard some good things about the Ignitors and Ardent, wondering if someone could shed some light from the experience as I don't have the money to just keep buying tyres and testing them out.
I ride all around, a lot more on the central coast of late Awaba/Ourimbah. Manly, Glenrock. I have yet to ride much south of Sydney.
Aaron
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Sounds like your own advice seems pretty good. Ignitors and Ardents make good front tyres, as do Nevegels and High Rollers. These are all what you would call a 'medium tread' tyre. In that they are adept at roughly all conditions. But usually excel in softer trails, or maybe rockier trails. For Australian/Sydney conditions, you do not really need a wet/mud tyre.
Any opinions on which may be better for the trails around Sydney? And if they work on both front/rear or a different combination might be better.
And has anyone had experience with a Rendez Tyre, good or bad things to say about them? Main reason i ask, i do like them, but i have nothing to compare them against.
Coming from the UK I've had a bit of experience with mud tyres. Bontrager Mud X, Maxxis Madusa and Panaracer Cinders were all good mud tyres that I have used. These all have quite high square edge profiles that will cut through the wet sloppy stuff and hopefully find something to grip. They don't roll well at all, so you have to put in a bit more effort when using them and the squirm all over the place in the bends on hard pack or tarmac.
Since moving to Sydney I have never considered using these tyres as I feel there is no need to have a specific winter / mud tyre and I have stuck with the same tyre throughout the year. Not only is there not enough mud around to warrant one, the compound of these tyres is usually so soft they're likely to last only a couple of hundred K's on the harsh sandpaper like Sydney sandstone.
The only thing that I have started to notice recently is when it is wet sand tends to stick to my tyres, which means when you come out of a sandy part of a trail on to either a rocky or rooty area, the sand stuck to my tyre causes it to slip. I've got bit of a theory that as the tyre slides, eventually the sand will come off the tread exposing tyre material to the rock or root, so using a small blocked tyres such as WTB Weir wolfs (Which I'm currently using) WTB Prowlers, Maxxis Ignitors and even Kenda Small Block 8's, the contact patch is exposed sooner compared to using a large blocked pattern such as Specialized Eskar, Maxxis High Rollers, Maxxis Minions and Kenda Nevegals. Sounds good on paper and I think there is a noticeable difference with my Weir wolf up front.
Tyre choice is very personal and you are going to get a mix of opinions on this thread, but one thing I think most will agree on, is you won't need a mud specific tyre this winter. Unless you are planning a trip to the UK.
For trail riding on public trails in Sydney, riding in wet/muddy conditions is generally frowned upon due to the erosion it causes and the grief that leads to with land managers.
I know it's a lot of fun - I used to do it too, until I found out that it was regarded as a no-no.
But on private land where you have permission and the owner is unconcerned there's nothing to stop you - so long as wearing out your drive train doesn't worry you!
Ignitors are OK-ish when trails are damp but aren't an outright mud tyre. The conventional wisdom for mud is to use a narrower tyre like a 1.8 to penetrate the goop, and have widely spaced blocky lugs to allow the mud to clear off the tyre and let the lugs engage with the firmer goop below. So I'm guessing something ike the Maxxis Wet Scream is designed to fit that requirement. But it is not going to be suitable for all round use due to the very specific conditions it is intended for. Example: they'll suck in sand, and be harsh and hard to push along on hardpack.
For general dry Sydney trail conditions, Maxxis Monorail on the front teamed with Maxxis Larsen TT on the rear is getting a good reputation. I've used Ignitor front with Crossmark and larsen rears. The Crossmark rolled better but the Larsen is better for climbing and braking traction. The Maxxis Ignitor grips well, but gives little warning when its envelope is exceeded, so I'm looking to jump on the Monorail bandwagon when I'm next in the market for front rubber.
Hi hawkeye,
I have just changed my front tyre to the Ignitor, and now i read your comments about it, but I don't understand what you mean by "gives little warning when its envelope is exceeded". could you explain it? Sorry for my llittle knowledge on the subject, and thanks for the explanation.
He means they grip well but when they let go there is no warning, all or nothing.
Erm, sorry.
I was having one of my Kevin Rudd moments. 
The Ignitor is quite a good front tyre, and I'm still using it. You just need to be aware of its little habits.
I find very occasionally with the ignitor that the front will suddenly wash out. Each time it was a surprise I had no idea was coming. I managed to catch it each time, but it put the wind up me.
Rob and others have made the same comment.
I gather from other more experienced riders that some of the others you'd consider for a front tyre do slide more controllably. Instead of going from railing to "bang!" no more traction when pushed too hard, the transition to sliding starts a little earlier, giving you more time to react by sticking your inside foot out, shifting your weight, getting on the back brake to drift the rear, changing line, etc.
For now I'm happy to pootle along staying well within the limits of the tyres I have on (2 x ignitors UST @2.35), but once I get some clarity on where I'm going with my shoulder and I'm in a position to plan a return to racing I'll be looking at trying something different. One of the things I like about it is that at 2.35 wide it handles sand sections quite well.
I have a freeride bike and use a Maxxis Minion on the front that is 42a compound and it doesnt wear much on sandstone and grips well when it gets a bit muddy and when the boardwalks around the dam are slippery. For a rear I use a harder compound Maxxis High Roller (60a) so that I can actually ride up hills. Although this harder compound tyre still wears about 5 times more than the front tyre does.
Both tyres are 2.50's and so are probably too wide for you, although they do let me run low pressures and hence get more grip (I've been down to 10psi on the front by accident and it did not pinch the tubes)
Yeah, I am conscious of riding trails that should not be ridden because of their condition. I guess where I said muddy was probably not the best term. Also sometimes you cannot get away from such conditions when you're riding in pre organised events, and to be prepared is going to help.
I guess what i supposed to say, as we are getting into winter, the days for good riding might be a little more sparse, and the ground probably is going to be fairly damp/soft in comparison to our summer riding. This is where i was thinking of using the tyres.
All the Advice has been very good, I have heard also that the Ignitor can wash away with little warning to no warning, I am leaning towards trying the Ardent if the Rendez starts to feel to washy.
Yeah 2.5's are going to be too wide for me, I will probably run up to 2.35 on the front.
I can highly recommend the Ardents. Although they are listed as 2.25 wide they measure approximately the same as the 2.35" Ignitors. I run them tubeless on the front and they have given me vastly improved grip over the 2.1" Ignitors I had on previously.
Why not try the 2.35 Minion DHF? That can come in Single or Dual Ply, and also UST or for tubes. I also run these on a bigger bike and have never had issues with cornering grip from it. The Minion DHF is an awesome design IMO.
Hey Rob,
How about putting peoples tyre choice to a vote in your Poll section on the home page?
You could start with all round front tyres, list the main contenders and then do it for the rears?
Chris
+1 to the Minion 2.35 DHF in Super Tacky. Not as soft as the Slow Reezay so it'll last longer, but still such a grippy front tyre for most of Sydney's trails. Get it in single ply to save some weight.
FWIW I found the minion DHF single ply to be the grippiest most predictable front tyre to date - down side is it rolls slow and is heavy. An excellent tyre to use while you get your confidence up in all conditions across sydney.
There will be plenty of 'votes' for the minimalist rubber tyres like monorail, larson, small block 8, and to some degree the legendary crossmark, and these tyres are generally used by more experienced riders, and give good speed at the expense of some cornering grip.
The Ignitor is a love it or hate it tyre. Personally I find it too unpredictable at the limit (washes out with little control, unless run at low pressure, at which time you are in danger of pinch flatting or burping)
Personally I currently use Racing Ralphs 2.2 & Small block 8's 2.0 (F/R) on my race bike, and love the Nevegal as an general all round tyre on my fun bikes. A Nevegal front and small block 8 or Larson rear is a good combo giving plenty of grip for climbing, reasonable rolling, and some decent grip on the front.
Finally - Tubeless will give better grip and rolling compared to tubed tyres - with the caveat that some tubeless tyres are so heavy the benefits are negated. I use non-tubeless tyres 'tubeless' on stans rims, and get the benefits of both worlds.
There are also a few comments in my blog about tubeless if you are interested: http://nobmob.com/node/6453 (long term tubeless report)
W.
Anyone can create a poll... just make sure you include loads of options
Or else "other" ends up being the big winner............ not much help to anybody really.
Candy!
As already mentioned, it depends on the application & skill level i.e. mud tire that's good in cornering and lightweight (XC/race focus) or something to play on and you don't mind the added grams while having the know-how to drop your foot off the pedal to drift through a corner...